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It seems I have had a lovely day of conversing internally with your ideas as I started my day listening to this podcast and ended my day reading Part 3 of your 4 part series. Lots of thoughts spurred by both and a place where they intersect for me.
I won't beat around the bush. Ken Wilber is, to me, exactly the kind of "over his skis" pseudo expert you lament in your piece. I'm old enough to have seen his whole rise and fall including seeing him act as an absolute asshole. Mark Manson describes it pretty well here: https://markmanson.net/ken-wilber
Note the section on what the experts of different fields think about how Wilber interprets their work.
Now that doesn't mean his ideas are unworthy, but I invite you to revisit them from a less admiring place. For a couple of reasons - firstly, I think you could probably bring a new perspective to spiral dynamics/intergral psychology that would actually make it fuller and more whole. What would a spiral dynamics rooted in the feminine principle look like and sound like? Maybe instead of "include and transcend" it would be something like "embrace and deepen". Maybe like the layers of bark on a tree instead of always that upward energy? Do we really need anymore fucking rockets? LOL Did you notice as you and Nicole talked through the colours you were talking almost exclusively about the world of men? Wars, swords of discernment, moon shots etc. Almost all of the examples were male. Bring me the sewing scissors of discernment instead! I think if you wanted to play with this there is a lot of potential here to re-imagine it more holistically - and you may be the one to do it!
Secondly - I use the word play quite deliberately. I have worked with women for over 20 years now and the bright ones who love to play with ideas - like you and me and probably most of your readers - find these kinds of theories and systems highly engaging. But it is worth always reminding ourselves that the map is not the territory and these are fun tools but we don't want them to become weapons or cages that we trap ourselves in. It can be useful to think of the body as a collection of skin and muscle and fascia and tendon and bone but when you dissect the body it is hard to tell exactly where tendon becomes bone. I'm saying this as much as a reminder for me as anything.
I so appreciate all you are exploring and the issues you are raising. It really pisses me off that only one man has interviewed you about your book. I had a similar experience years ago on a much, much smaller scale. Seth Godin had put out a free e-book asking all these different thought leaders about what they saw coming and I was so frustrated at how few women he included that I politely asked him if I could use his idea and make a similar book with women. He agreed and I made a fabulous ebook with contributions from a whole slew of amazing women including the likes of Brené Brown and Margaret Wheatley and women shared it like crazy on Twitter and FB and not a single man shared it. Not even Seth. Sad that not much has changed in the intervening years. But I hope the fact that it has hit some slack channels means some invitations are forthcoming!!!
Dear Elise,
It seems I have had a lovely day of conversing internally with your ideas as I started my day listening to this podcast and ended my day reading Part 3 of your 4 part series. Lots of thoughts spurred by both and a place where they intersect for me.
I won't beat around the bush. Ken Wilber is, to me, exactly the kind of "over his skis" pseudo expert you lament in your piece. I'm old enough to have seen his whole rise and fall including seeing him act as an absolute asshole. Mark Manson describes it pretty well here: https://markmanson.net/ken-wilber
Note the section on what the experts of different fields think about how Wilber interprets their work.
Now that doesn't mean his ideas are unworthy, but I invite you to revisit them from a less admiring place. For a couple of reasons - firstly, I think you could probably bring a new perspective to spiral dynamics/intergral psychology that would actually make it fuller and more whole. What would a spiral dynamics rooted in the feminine principle look like and sound like? Maybe instead of "include and transcend" it would be something like "embrace and deepen". Maybe like the layers of bark on a tree instead of always that upward energy? Do we really need anymore fucking rockets? LOL Did you notice as you and Nicole talked through the colours you were talking almost exclusively about the world of men? Wars, swords of discernment, moon shots etc. Almost all of the examples were male. Bring me the sewing scissors of discernment instead! I think if you wanted to play with this there is a lot of potential here to re-imagine it more holistically - and you may be the one to do it!
Secondly - I use the word play quite deliberately. I have worked with women for over 20 years now and the bright ones who love to play with ideas - like you and me and probably most of your readers - find these kinds of theories and systems highly engaging. But it is worth always reminding ourselves that the map is not the territory and these are fun tools but we don't want them to become weapons or cages that we trap ourselves in. It can be useful to think of the body as a collection of skin and muscle and fascia and tendon and bone but when you dissect the body it is hard to tell exactly where tendon becomes bone. I'm saying this as much as a reminder for me as anything.
I so appreciate all you are exploring and the issues you are raising. It really pisses me off that only one man has interviewed you about your book. I had a similar experience years ago on a much, much smaller scale. Seth Godin had put out a free e-book asking all these different thought leaders about what they saw coming and I was so frustrated at how few women he included that I politely asked him if I could use his idea and make a similar book with women. He agreed and I made a fabulous ebook with contributions from a whole slew of amazing women including the likes of Brené Brown and Margaret Wheatley and women shared it like crazy on Twitter and FB and not a single man shared it. Not even Seth. Sad that not much has changed in the intervening years. But I hope the fact that it has hit some slack channels means some invitations are forthcoming!!!
xox
Lianne